2019 Election thread

[caesarnapoleon]

You've seen em all in action..you know what they say is usually a lie.
Dummies fell for NDP in Alberta our economy imploded and they fiddled and yapped and got nothing done. imagine that for the entire country =o
The Liberals promise and promise and just spend..usually on themselves and raise taxes and make debt
The Conservatives are usually too chickenshit to make real changes and just raise debt and usually get tossed out because eventually they get corrupt as well.
The Green party..just see NDP..just with more green.
The Bloq is actively trying to destroy Canada and the Peoples party, well its a 1 man temper tantrum.
The ancient philosopher Plato saw all this centuries ago..if you check it out you'll realize..we are screwed.

 

[storm rider]

You've seen em all in action..you know what they say is usually a lie.
Dummies fell for NDP in Alberta our economy imploded and they fiddled and yapped and got nothing done. imagine that for the entire country =o
The Liberals promise and promise and just spend..usually on themselves and raise taxes and make debt
The Conservatives are usually too chickenshit to make real changes and just raise debt and usually get tossed out because eventually they get corrupt as well.
The Green party..just see NDP..just with more green.
The Bloq is actively trying to destroy Canada and the Peoples party, well its a 1 man temper tantrum.
The ancient philosopher Plato saw all this centuries ago..if you check it out you'll realize..we are screwed.

I dont agree.Under the Harper Government Canadian families were better off.Canadian families got a lot more tax credits that were immediate not "down the road".The Child Tax Credit was given to ALL,it was not as big as what the Lieberals "promised" but it was TAX EXEMPT whereas the Lieberal tax credit was fully taxable....do the math....say 1200 tax exempt or 2200 that is taxable but with the caveat of if you qualify under your shared income tax return.For the last 4 years the average Canadian family has been
paying $847 a year more in taxes and that is on direct taxable income never mind the extra added costs of the Carbon Tax.

You say Conservatives are corrupt huh?Tell me one instance when ANY Conservative Government lead by ANY leader STEAL 250 MILLION of tax payer money and channel it back to party insiders/cronies and most specifically ridings in Quebec.

I cant FATHOM how any citizen of Canada utterly FAILS to remember the Sponsorship Administration Program....aka....AD SCAM.....when that bastard Chretien appeared at the Gomery Enquirey and pulled out a cheap box of top flite xl-2000 golf balls with the USA Presidential Seal on them to justify the 10+ MILLION that went to the golf course in his riding in Shawinigen in Quebec......how the fuck on earth do you FORGET something like that?

SR

 

[Ray]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_scandals_in_Canada

 

[clu]

so you think that if we keep letting in those who are Islamists, Sharia Law wannabes, who will eventually possibly make up 10% of the pop, they wouldn't be fringe?

how about the Greens now, May is basically saying we need to shutdown our economy, because you'd have to be delusional to think that we can actually do what she's saying

no oil, gas, propane, plastics, air flight, ect.....

if that isn't fringe what is?

don't care if they get 10%

they're still fringe

the Nazi Party, gets 10%, you wouldn't call them fringe? lol

fringe isn't a percentage, it's a ideology

stupid ideologies

It's all relative. 10% is 1 person for every 4 Conservative voters. Who are you to say which ideologies are fringe and which are not? To some of us, Conservatives have more in common with Sharia Law than you'd acknowledge (e.g. imposing restrictions on personal freedom based on subjective religious convictions, or fear and disdain of those that are not like "us").

The point is we are a plurality, a mosaic. The government of our country should be based on the common ground we can all find, not the pendulum of who was angered out of their apathy enough to vote out the previous lot once they sufficiently rubbed them the wrong way.

It's not about the numbers. It's about cooperation and common ground. Seems like about 40% of the US might be racist. Doesn't make it legit. The question is finding a system that allows the other 60% to live together with the 40%.

But it seems like no one believes in common ground anymore and the mere suggestion of cooperation is seen as a threat. These are sad times.

At this rate, I wouldn't be surprised if Reese's Pieces debuted in 2019 that it and its ad campaign would be protested and accused of having a subversive political agenda. Everyone on both sides of the spectrum is acting so damned indignant and threatened these days.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

You've seen em all in action..you know what they say is usually a lie.
Dummies fell for NDP in Alberta our economy imploded and they fiddled and yapped and got nothing done. imagine that for the entire country =o
The Liberals promise and promise and just spend..usually on themselves and raise taxes and make debt
The Conservatives are usually too chickenshit to make real changes and just raise debt and usually get tossed out because eventually they get corrupt as well.
The Green party..just see NDP..just with more green.
The Bloq is actively trying to destroy Canada and the Peoples party, well its a 1 man temper tantrum.
The ancient philosopher Plato saw all this centuries ago..if you check it out you'll realize..we are screwed.

Another reason to return to the Monarchy or even a Dictatorship with me as your Supreme Leader.
Free pussy for everyone!

 

[overdone]

It's all relative. 10% is 1 person for every 4 Conservative voters. Who are you to say which ideologies are fringe and which are not? To some of us, Conservatives have more in common with Sharia Law than you'd acknowledge (e.g. imposing restrictions on personal freedom based on subjective religious convictions, or fear and disdain of those that are not like "us").

The point is we are a plurality, a mosaic. The government of our country should be based on the common ground we can all find, not the pendulum of who was angered out of their apathy enough to vote out the previous lot once they sufficiently rubbed them the wrong way.

It's not about the numbers. It's about cooperation and common ground. Seems like about 40% of the US might be racist. Doesn't make it legit. The question is finding a system that allows the other 60% to live together with the 40%.

so you're all for the Nazis amongst us to be able to wear a Swastika arm band to work?

you think the convictions of a Nazi are any different than that of a Sharia Islamist?

what do you think the Hajab/Niqab/Burka are symbols of?
they aren't fashion choices, despite what the woke Liberals want you to believe
don't listen to actual moderate Muslims, what they think

religions are IDEOLOGIES, just like Fascism, Communism, there are no differences, they are fringes

based on their basic tenants, not a % of their acceptance

they are based on US vs THEM

you're one of them or you're not

no in between



Conservatives, yes, cause the Liberals don't have anything in common with Sharia, after-all they were going to institute it in ONTARIO under Mcdickface

and they don't have a "not like us" mentality, or have you not heard Barbie talk ever, or Turdeau for that matter, in those terms

spare me, I don't see them standing up to Que, bill 21, or the NDP, aren't they suppose to be all about rights?




there are fringes in every party in Canada, they have to go somewhere to try to get power, but they are outnumbered, greatly, usually

we already have a system that is based on cooperation and common ground

you think the Liberals and Conservatives, hell even the NDP aren't basically all the same?

the 6 degrees of separation between them isn't large enough to put 2 by four thru, lol

reminds me of watching Futurama

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ll3iyvbsRDM

you start changing our system

then those fringes, will, like in other countries start forming their own parties

our system contains them, somewhat

 

[storm rider]

As of this morning even before any other party could do anything the Lieberals announced that they pledged Canada is to bet net ZERO CO2 emissions by 2050 per the move by the United Nations yesterday.....damn they are so desperate to change the channel on the brownface/blackface scandal.

Right off the bat it is IMPOSSIBLE.It is also virtue signalling and if is truly intended then is is a giant leap towards globalism and a one world order.Sorry but Canada should not be directing it's own internal affairs per the directive of the UN.

No CO2 emissions by 2050 huh?Well how in the wide world of sports do you get rid of the CO2 from 36 million Canadians that consume oxygen and exude carbon dioxide?

FFS this Climate Change sham is getting just plain fucking stupid.

For the icing on the cake Trudeau has said he will not participate in the MAIN televised english language debate.He dodged the opening debate a day after the election started and stated he wont appear at 2 others and now has dodged another debate and looks only to participate in the french language debate so he can pander to Quebec.Gives him that much more time to memorize the script Gerald Butts will be writing for him to recite.

SR

 

[testicles]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_scandals_in_Canada

Ugh, the King-Byng Affair. That brings back memories of social studies class.

 

[clu]

so you're all for the Nazis amongst us to be able to wear a Swastika arm band to work?

you think the convictions of a Nazi are any different than that of a Sharia Islamist?

I could see that straw man argument coming a mile away. Tried to avoid it with careful phrasing but here we go anyway. Again nuance and subtlety are lost.

No I do not. I am not saying there's no such thing as antisocial ideologies. I'm saying that what you are labelling as fringe (Green) is debatable. To discount Green or whatever as fringe is a sign of someone who doesn't really play well with others. And for the record I don't support Green but that's no reason to dismiss them as fringe. Times are changing. Rational thinking people can have new thoughts in an evolving world.

I'm not saying there isn't such a thing as fringe. I'm saying that you don't get to call every ideology you don't agree with fringe as a way of silencing their right to contribute to the discussion of how the country should be run. Some Americans would still call the most right wing government we've ever had "socialism" and those same people see socialism as fringe.

The test for "fringe" should not be uncommon ideas but socially harmful ones. Government should be a collaboration in our mutual best interest. We obviously don't agree on what that is, hence we need a collaboration and compromise, but on a basic level "mutual best interest" would obviously exclude anything that makes one citizen less than another. So that rules out Nazis, Sharia Law, the Conservatives' proposal on revising citizenship, etc.

Conservatives, yes, cause the Liberals don't have anything in common with Sharia,

I already mentioned a few things I don't like about the Liberals upthread. You certainly have the us vs. them mentality in spades. Just because I felt the Liberals' failures had been pointed out enough in this thread and decided to level the playing field by pointing out the Conservatives are no saints or objectively superior doesn't mean I support the Liberals.

Let me be perfectly clear: I support proportional representation because I don't think any party has the integrity to rule. They'll play to their base or self-interest at the expense of everyone else. Trump, Trudeau, Harper, etc.

I'm not playing favourites.

I used to hate minority governments but I've come to appreciate that in the time of minority governments we don't get extreme shifts toward one base at the expense of another.

 

[Correct]

I just hope that we don't get another term with Aladdin in power.

 

[Correct]

Apparently the latest is, the fellow dressed up as James Bond for another school function - seems like an interesting choice for the highly respected feminist to have all the gals clinging to his dapper tux. :drum:

Honestly it isn't his costumes that bother me.
It is his deep rooted corruption.
After the SNC debacle, I am done with trying to find any good in the guy.

 

[clu]

Apparently the latest is, the fellow dressed up as James Bond for another school function - seems like an interesting choice for the highly respected feminist to have all the gals clinging to his dapper tux. :drum:

Completely non-political question: how does one tell the difference between dressing up as James Bond and merely dressing up in a tux? Honest question.

 

[overdone]

I could see that straw man argument coming a mile away. Tried to avoid it with careful phrasing but here we go anyway. Again nuance and subtlety are lost.

No I do not. I am not saying there's no such thing as antisocial ideologies. I'm saying that what you are labelling as fringe (Green) is debatable. To discount Green or whatever as fringe is a sign of someone who doesn't really play well with others. And for the record I don't support Green but that's no reason to dismiss them as fringe. Times are changing. Rational thinking people can have new thoughts in an evolving world.



I already mentioned a few things I don't like about the Liberals upthread. You certainly have the us vs. them mentality in spades. Just because I felt the Liberals' failures had been pointed out enough in this thread and decided to level the playing field by pointing out the Conservatives are no saints or objectively superior doesn't mean I support the Liberals.

Let me be perfectly clear: I support proportional representation because I don't think any party has the integrity to rule. They'll play to their base or self-interest at the expense of everyone else. Trump, Trudeau, Harper, etc.

I'm not playing favourites.

I used to hate minority governments but I've come to appreciate that in the time of minority governments we don't get extreme shifts toward one base at the expense of another.

then according to you no one is on the fringe



yeah I am full of us vs them

Canadians vs everyone else

Canadians who were born here, immigrated here legally, aren't criminals from another country

aren't here showing support for their other country

but put Canada first

always





and once again

PPR, Ranking, won't solve your issues

it hasn't anywhere else in the world

they're still politicians

 

[clu]

then according to you no one is on the fringe

Admit it, you only read 3-4 words then angrily hit reply, am I right? In any case you missed the edit where I explicitly wrote:

I'm not saying there isn't such a thing as fringe. I'm saying that you don't get to call every ideology you don't agree with fringe as a way of silencing their right to contribute to the discussion of how the country should be run. Some Americans would still call the most right wing government we've ever had "socialism" and those same people see socialism as fringe.

The test for "fringe" should not be uncommon ideas but socially harmful ones. Government should be a collaboration in our mutual best interest. We obviously don't agree on what that is, hence we need a collaboration and compromise, but on a basic level "mutual best interest" would obviously exclude anything that makes one citizen less than another. So that rules out Nazis, Sharia Law, the Conservatives' proposal on revising citizenship, etc.

Clear now?

You continue:

yeah I am full of us vs them

Canadians vs everyone else

Canadians who were born here, immigrated here legally, aren't criminals from another country

aren't here showing support for their other country

but put Canada first

always

You're changing the topic unless you think every Green supporter is a dubious immigrant. How are you conflating what you see as "fringe" with illegal immigration?

No party advocates illegal immigration.

Now if you are saying you don't want acceptance of legal immigrants, that's not the same thing. If you're calling people who aren't xenophobic of immigrants "fringe" well that's your opinion, and that carries only equal weight -- no more, no less -- to each born-here Canadian that would disagree with you.

And that's the whole point: you don't want to acknowledge that actual born-here Canadians with every bit as much right to steer the country don't think like you. But to your mind they're either foreign ideologies or fringe. I'm not saying there aren't such things. You're just applying the label way too liberally.

 

[clu]

A perspective:

Jody Wilson-Raybould wants a minority government and is willing 'to work with whomever' is in power

 

[Humour]

Why? As it stands FPtP means that more than half the population at any given time does not agree with the chosen government.

If 10% of the population agrees with a party, that's not fringe.

Under FPtP a government can get more than 50% of the vote so your blanket statement is simply wrong.

10% is fringe. I guess we will agree to I agree on that.

 

[clu]

Under FPtP a government can get more than 50% of the vote so your blanket statement is simply wrong.

10% is fringe. I guess we will agree to I agree on that.

I didn't say "can" I said "does" (doesn't). Practical not theoretical. So yes a blanket statement that is not what I actually said is wrong.

And again 10% is 1 person for every 4 that actually voted for the last several ruling governments. It's not fringe by quantity. Open your eyes. We are not a monoculture.

 

[Humour]

I didn't say "can" I said "does" (doesn't). Practical not theoretical. So yes a blanket statement that is not what I actually said is wrong.

And again 10% is 1 person for every 4 that actually voted for the last several ruling governments. It's not fringe by quantity. Open your eyes. We are not a monoculture.

That’s laughable. Your statement was “FPtP means that more than half the population at any given time does not agree with the chosen government.” FPtP does not “mean” that.

As I said, let’s agree to disagree on the 10%. For someone who preaches cooperation and laments that we all can’t get along you should respect that instead of harping on it.

 

[storm rider]

Still no reaction or opinions about Trudeau ducking out/dodging the biggest televised leaders debate for the hustings?

SR

 

[clu]

That’s laughable. Your statement was “FPtP means that more than half the population at any given time does not agree with the chosen government.” FPtP does not “mean” that.

Laughable? Since the NDP formed, there has been one party that managed to squeeze out almost exactly 50% of the popular vote. That was under Brian Mulroney in 1984. But that's going to be your rebuttal? That my statement about what does happen is "laughable" because it's theoretically possible for it not to be true, even though it has been the case every election but one since we had 3 Federal party contenders? The winning party usually hovers more under 40%. So yes practically it "means" FPtP, in the Canadian political geography we have, will almost guarantee a government that is not elected by the majority of voters. But please do continue to focus on semantics of what "means" means as a way to avoid a meaningful rebuttal.

BTW:

See that big black line in the late 90s and early 2000s? That's a radical "fringe" party called the Reform Party (who are now the Conservatives). But of course we shouldn't be allowing radical fringe parties to gain a foothold.