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Vandana Shiva on the latest battleground in the war on Planet Earth

Miss*Bijou

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Nov 9, 2006
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A brilliant, amazing and fascinating woman with a super important message... :thumb:



Vandana Shiva on the Problem with Genetically-Modified Seeds


Bill Moyers talks to scientist and philosopher Vandana Shiva, who’s become a rock star in the global battle over genetically modified seeds. These seeds — considered “intellectual property” by the big companies who own the patents — are globally marketed to monopolize food production and profits. Opponents challenge the safety of genetically modified seeds, claiming they also harm the environment, are more costly, and leave local farmers deep in debt as well as dependent on suppliers. Shiva, who founded a movement in India to promote native seeds, links genetic tinkering to problems in our ecology, economy, and humanity, and sees this as the latest battleground in the war on Planet Earth.

http://billmoyers.com/segment/vandana-shiva-on-the-problem-with-genetically-modified-seeds/




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And if you're interested..



Controlling Our Food: The World According to Monsanto

A great documentary exposing the evil agricultural nightmare called Monsanto and the story of Roundup and Roundup Ready Soybeans. Featuring, George Bush Sr. A 2004 documentary film which makes an in-depth investigation into unlabelled, patented, genetically engineered foods that have quietly made their way onto grocery stores in the United States for the past decade.

It voices the opinions of farmers in disagreement with the food industry and details the impacts on their lives and livelihoods from this new technology, and shines a light on the market and political forces that are changing what we eat. The film decries the cost of a globalized food industry on human lives around the world, and highlights how international companies are gradually driving farmers off the land in many countries.

Potential global dependence of the human race on a limited number of global food corporations is discussed, as is the increased risk of ecological disasters – such as the Irish Potato Famine (1845–1849) – resulting from the reduction of biological diversity due to the promotion of corporate sponsored monoculture farming. The issue of incorporating a terminator gene into plant seeds is questioned, with concern being expressed about the potential for a widespread catastrophe affecting the food supply, should such a gene contaminate other plants in the wild. Legal stories reported by the film related how a number of farmers in North America have been sued by Monsanto; and the defendant of the Monsanto Canada Inc. v. Schmeiser case is interviewed.


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Miss*Bijou

Sexy Troublemaker
Nov 9, 2006
3,132
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Additional info...





The Pros and Cons of Genetically Modified Seeds
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB126862629333762259.html





GMO Facts
Frequently Asked Questions


GMOs, or “genetically modified organisms,” are plants or animals created through the gene splicing techniques of biotechnology (also called genetic engineering, or GE). This experimental technology merges DNA from different species, creating unstable combinations of plant, animal, bacterial and viral genes that cannot occur in nature or in traditional crossbreeding.

Virtually all commercial GMOs are engineered to withstand direct application of herbicide and/or to produce an insecticide. Despite biotech industry promises, none of the GMO traits currently on the market offer increased yield, drought tolerance, enhanced nutrition, or any other consumer benefit.

Meanwhile, a growing body of evidence connects GMOs with health problems, environmental damage and violation of farmers’ and consumers’ rights.


Are GMOs safe?
Most developed nations do not consider GMOs to be safe. In nearly 50 countries around the world, including Australia, Japan, and all of the countries in the European Union, there are significant restrictions or outright bans on the production and sale of GMOs. In the U.S., the government has approved GMOs based on studies conducted by the same corporations that created them and profit from their sale. Increasingly, Americans are taking matters into their own hands and choosing to opt out of the GMO experiment.

Are GMOs labeled?
Unfortunately, even though polls consistently show that a significant majority of Americans want to know if the food they’re purchasing contains GMOs, the powerful biotech lobby has succeeded in keeping this information from the public. In the absence of mandatory labeling, the Non-GMO Project was created to give consumers the informed choice they deserve.

Where does the Non-GMO Project come in?
The Non-GMO Project is a non-profit organization with a mission of protecting the non-GMO food supply and giving consumers an informed choice. We offer North America’s ONLY third party verification for products produced according to rigorous best practices for GMO avoidance (for more info, click here). Our strategy is to empower consumers to make change through the marketplace. If people stop buying GMOs, companies will stop using them and farmers will stop growing them.

Do Americans want non-GMO foods and supplements?
Polls consistently show that a significant majority of North Americans would like to be able to tell if the food they’re purchasing contains GMOs (a 2008 CBS News Poll found that 87% of consumers wanted GMOs labeled). And, according to a recent CBS/New York Times poll, 53% of consumers said they would not buy food that has been genetically modified. The Non-GMO Project’s seal for verified products will, for the first time, give the public an opportunity to make an informed choice when it comes to GMOs.

How common are GMOs?

In the U.S., GMOs are in as much as 80% of conventional processed food. Click here for a current list of GMO risk crops.

What are the impacts of GMOs on the environment?
Over 80% of all GMOs grown worldwide are engineered for herbicide tolerance. As a result, use of toxic herbicides like Roundup has increased 15 times since GMOs were introduced. GMO crops are also responsible for the emergence of “super weeds” and “super bugs:’ which can only be killed with ever more toxic poisons like 2,4-D (a major ingredient in Agent Orange). GMOs are a direct extension of chemical agriculture, and are developed and sold by the world’s biggest chemical companies. The long-term impacts of GMOs are unknown, and once released into the environment these novel organisms cannot be recalled.

How do GMOs affect farmers?
Because GMOs are novel life forms, biotechnology companies have been able to obtain patents with which to restrict their use. As a result, the companies that make GMOs now have the power to sue farmers whose fields are contaminated with GMOs, even when it is the result of inevitable drift from neighboring fields. GMOs therefore pose a serious threat to farmer sovereignty and to the national food security of any country where they are grown, including the United States.

How can I avoid GMOs?

Choose food and products that are Non-GMO Project Verified! Click here to see a complete list.

Are my kids eating genetically engineered food?
The sad truth is many of the foods that are most popular with children contain GMOs. Cereals, snack bars, snack boxes, cookies, processed lunch meats, and crackers all contain large amounts of high risk food ingredients. In North America, over 80% of our food contains GMOs. If you are not buying foods that are Non-GMO Project Verified, most likely GMOs are present at breakfast, lunch, and dinner.

What are the most common GMOs?
The most common GMOs are soy, cotton, canola, corn, sugar beets, Hawaiian papaya, alfalfa, and squash (zucchini and yellow). Many of these items appear as added ingredients in a large amount of the foods we eat. For instance, your family may not eat tofu or drink soy milk, but soy is most likely present in a large percentage of the foods in your pantry.

GMOs may be hidden in common processed food ingredients such as: Amino Acids, Aspartame, Ascorbic Acid, Sodium Ascorbate, Vitamin C, Citric Acid, Sodium Citrate, Flavorings (“natural” and “artificial”), High Fructose Corn Syrup, Hydrolyzed Vegetable Protein, Lactic Acid, Maltodextrins, Molasses, Monosodium Glutamate, Sucrose, Textured Vegetable Protein (TVP), Xanthan Gum, Vitamins, Yeast Products.


http://www.nongmoproject.org/learn-more/


<a title="View GMO Myths and Truths 1.3 on Scribd" href="http://www.scribd.com/doc/100253751/GMO-Myths-and-Truths-1-3" style="margin: 12px auto 6px auto; font-family: Helvetica,Arial,Sans-serif; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 14px; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none; display: block; text-decoration: underline;">GMO Myths and Truths 1.3</a><iframe class="scribd_iframe_embed" src="http://www.scribd.com/embeds/100253751/content?start_page=1&view_mode=list&access_key=key-125ser61ki77zoe6nqfs" data-auto-height="false" data-aspect-ratio="0.707514450867052" scrolling="no" id="doc_3488" width="400" height="600" frameborder="0"></iframe>





The Non-GMO Sourcebook
http://www.nongmosourcebook.com/non-gmosourcebook/nongmosoybeansuppliers.php




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skiguru

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May 21, 2005
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I like the idea of giving GMO unrestricted access to the market and letting the market decide if the product has value for the consumers or not.
This is a good idea. It shouldn't be possible for one company to control the market the way Monsanto does.
 

InnocentBoy

Banned
Mar 5, 2006
845
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http://www.naturalnews.com/036477_Monsanto_immunity_GM_crops.html
Full exemption from the law for the biotech industry

Authored by Congressmen and Chairman of the Subcommittee on Agriculture, Rural Development, Food and Drug Administration (FDA), and Related Agencies Jack Kingston (R-Ga.), the 2013 Agriculture Appropriations Bill rider, known as the "farmer assurance provision" (Section 733), specifically outlines that the Secretary of Agriculture will be required, upon request, to "immediately" grant temporary approval or deregulation of a GM crop, even if that crop's safety is in question or under review.
 

skiguru

Member
May 21, 2005
74
0
6
http://www.naturalnews.com/036477_Monsanto_immunity_GM_crops.html
Full exemption from the law for the biotech industry

Authored by Congressmen and Chairman of the Subcommittee on Agriculture, Rural Development, Food and Drug Administration (FDA), and Related Agencies Jack Kingston (R-Ga.), the 2013 Agriculture Appropriations Bill rider, known as the "farmer assurance provision" (Section 733), specifically outlines that the Secretary of Agriculture will be required, upon request, to "immediately" grant temporary approval or deregulation of a GM crop, even if that crop's safety is in question or under review.
Just goes to show you that money can't buy love, but it can get you a congressman!
 

Tugela

New member
Oct 26, 2010
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I like the idea of giving GMO unrestricted access to the market and letting the market decide if the product has value for the consumers or not.

Herbicide resistance increases yields, if one's land has weeds competing with the crop plants and one has the money to pay for & apply the necessary herbicides. Of course, over use of herbicides encourages the natural selection for resistance to those chemicals in the pest plants, so this angle of research is ultimately self limiting as the herbicides lose effectiveness.

GMO's that produce their own insecticides increase yields if you have pest insects eating your crops. It does get the jump on the bugs since it starts working as soon as the bugs start eating versus reacting with a manual application of pesticide after noticing damage & thus already experiencing yield loss.

The push for greater theoretical production from annual crop species without also including increased resistance to pests & disease is a stop gap goal at best. What is needed is greater research and development of grain crops based on perennial plants. Seed once, harvest for many years. No tilling most years means less fuel inputs, less soil erosion & less moisture loss. Deep roots that can access deeper moisture requiring less irrigation / rainfall. The extensive root system also is a good sink for carbon. The problem is there are no great profits in such seed so the research relies solely on Gov't grants & "charitable" private sponsorship.
Actually, the use of herbicides in general has a far more devastating and insidious effect on ecological systems than any bioengineered plant.

Many plants produce natural herbicides to give them an advantage over other species. The genes that produce these are incorporated in food producing species so they can have the same effect, thereby eliminating the need for indiscrimate use of artificial herbicides. It is sort of like using a sniper rifle to take out your enemy as opposed to a 5 ton bomb.

I wouldn't worry about bioengineered plants that produce their own insecticides either, this is actually a common weapon in plant's arsenals. In fact, the genes used to produce these insecticides come from regular plants, so, if people are worried about them "escaping", why are they not worried about the same thing happening in species where the gene normally occurrs in? The answer is simple: Ignorance and fear (the exploitation of which, to achieve an unrelated agenda).

Bijou doesn't understand that plants themselves are in constant biological warfare against predation and other plants.
 

Tugela

New member
Oct 26, 2010
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Oh, one more thing, that woman is decked out in religous symbols, I'm guessing that much of what she preaches is based on distorting science to promote her cultural philosophy.

If a christian or muslim was using this tactic I suspect that Bijou would not be saying "A brilliant, amazing and fascinating woman with a super important message.." ;)
 

Miss*Bijou

Sexy Troublemaker
Nov 9, 2006
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Oh, one more thing, that woman is decked out in religous symbols, I'm guessing that much of what she preaches is based on distorting science to promote her cultural philosophy.

If a christian or muslim was using this tactic I suspect that Bijou would not be saying "A brilliant, amazing and fascinating woman with a super important message.." ;)

OMG What are you talking about? Exactly what tactics would she be using, to promote what "cultural philosophy" and based on what "distorted science"?


That she's wearing religious symbols is completely irrelevant to me. And why would it make any difference whether she was Muslim, Christian, Jewish or Hindu?

I mean, really, what are you talking about? :confused:
 
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Miss*Bijou

Sexy Troublemaker
Nov 9, 2006
3,132
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Actually, the use of herbicides in general has a far more devastating and insidious effect on ecological systems than any bioengineered plant.

Many plants produce natural herbicides to give them an advantage over other species. The genes that produce these are incorporated in food producing species so they can have the same effect, thereby eliminating the need for indiscrimate use of artificial herbicides. It is sort of like using a sniper rifle to take out your enemy as opposed to a 5 ton bomb.

I wouldn't worry about bioengineered plants that produce their own insecticides either, this is actually a common weapon in plant's arsenals. In fact, the genes used to produce these insecticides come from regular plants, so, if people are worried about them "escaping", why are they not worried about the same thing happening in species where the gene normally occurrs in? The answer is simple: Ignorance and fear (the exploitation of which, to achieve an unrelated agenda).


Only, there are many significant differences. Just to name a few:

Plants haven't yet naturally produced (and never will) an insecticide to attack the very insects that pollinate them - bioengineered plants, on the other hand, may have done just that. They may have been effectively responsible for killing off entire colonies and been responsible for a serious crisis that has been unexplained for a few years and which seriously threatens global food production.




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Plants that have not been bioengineered are also not patented by a huge corporation, which then makes insane profits selling their patented seeds.

Plants that have not been bioengineered can be re-used from year to year by farmers, unlike bioengineered patented seeds that have also been modified to be useless after the first year's planting.

Plants that have not been bioengineered do not contaminate other plants, whether bioengineered or not, with their genes - in effect, spreading a patented product whether farmers want it or not, and then exposing them to law suits for their unauthorized use of patented seeds.

Genetically modified foods have not and are not thoroughly scientifically tested.

They are not identified on labels - why is that? If there is absolutely nothing different with the end product, why would there be so much resistance to letting consumers know what they're eating?



GMO seeds have been genetically modified to produce their own pesticide, survive the spraying of Roundup and self terminate. They are also incredibly expensive compared to traditional seeds. As a result, farmers in India were forced into total dependence on Monsanto by having to purchase new seeds annually. Because of Monsanto's ruthless drive to use India as a testing ground, 125,000 farmers took their own lives after being driven into a hopeless cycle of debt and losing their lands and homes.

GMOs, which were never adequately tested for safety, have failed catastrophically. At least 70% of our food contains genetically engineered food brought by Monsanto. GMO is endangering our health and environment at an alarming rate. Cross contamination is irreversible and good organic crops are being jeopardized.

Farmers in India are finding that the "biotechnology revolution" is having a devastating effect on their crop lands and personal debt levels. "In 1998, the World Bank's structural adjustment policies forced India to open up its seed sector to global corporations like Cargill, Monsanto, and Syngenta. The global corporations changed the input economy overnight. Farm saved seeds were replaced by corporate seeds which needed fertilizers and pesticides and could not be saved" Says Vandana Shiva, leader of the movement to oust Monsanto from India.

Monsanto, GM foods & health risks

Rhetoric from the United States government since the early 1990s proclaims that genetically modified (GM) foods are no different from their natural counterparts that have existed for centuries. But this is a political, not a scientific assertion. Numerous scientists at the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) consistently described these newly introduced gene-spliced foods as cause for concern. In addition to their potential to produce hard-to-detect allergies and nutritional problems, the scientists said that “The possibility of unexpected, accidental changes in genetically engineered plants” might produce “unexpected high concentrations of plant toxicants.”1 GM crops, they said, might have “Increased levels of known naturally occurring toxins, . . . appearance of new, not previously identified” toxins, and an increased tendency to gather “toxic substances from the environment” such as “pesticides or heavy metals.” They recommended testing every GM food “before it enters the marketplace.”2 But the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) was under orders from the first Bush White House to promote the biotechnology industry, and the political appointee in charge of agency policy was the former attorney for biotech giant Monsanto—and later became their vice president. The FDA policy ignored the scientists’ warnings and allowed GM food crops onto the market without any required safety studies.


Terminator technology


Monsanto came under heavy public fire with the development of their "Terminator Technology", a.k.a. "suicide seeds", known technically as V-GURTs (varietal Genetic Use Restriction Technologies) in which the seeds resulting from the first year's planting would be sterile thereby forcing farmers around the world in the Roundup Ready System to buy their seed from them every year rather than saving their best seed for the next years planting, a traditional and economical practice. Seed saving has had the benefit of allowing farmers to continually improve the quality of their crops through careful artificial selection.

Fears were also expressed that Monsanto's terminator genes could spread to wild plants. According to the UN Commission on Genetic Resources for Food and Agriculture, "Cross-fertilising V-GURT containing crops may cause considerable effects in neighbouring crop stands and wild relatives.... The fact that in North America, where large stands of GMO varieties are now grown contamination of non-GMO varieties by GMO germplasm has been observed ... suggests that this scenario is a realistic probability".

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Monsanto




Bijou doesn't understand that plants themselves are in constant biological warfare against predation and other plants.

What makes you think you know what I do or don't understand? :rolleyes:

 
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Miss*Bijou

Sexy Troublemaker
Nov 9, 2006
3,132
44
48
Montréal
I like the idea of giving GMO unrestricted access to the market and letting the market decide if the product has value for the consumers or not.

Herbicide resistance increases yields, if one's land has weeds competing with the crop plants and one has the money to pay for & apply the necessary herbicides. Of course, over use of herbicides encourages the natural selection for resistance to those chemicals in the pest plants, so this angle of research is ultimately self limiting as the herbicides lose effectiveness.

GMO's that produce their own insecticides increase yields if you have pest insects eating your crops. It does get the jump on the bugs since it starts working as soon as the bugs start eating versus reacting with a manual application of pesticide after noticing damage & thus already experiencing yield loss.

The push for greater theoretical production from annual crop species without also including increased resistance to pests & disease is a stop gap goal at best. What is needed is greater research and development of grain crops based on perennial plants. Seed once, harvest for many years. No tilling most years means less fuel inputs, less soil erosion & less moisture loss. Deep roots that can access deeper moisture requiring less irrigation / rainfall. The extensive root system also is a good sink for carbon. The problem is there are no great profits in such seed so the research relies solely on Gov't grants & "charitable" private sponsorship.


Problem with that is that no one knows when they're consuming it (which Monsanto insists on) so how can they decide whether it has value or not?

Since it also contaminates other crops, the market isn't really given any choice in the matter - it's just taking over and spreading whether the consumers or farmers think it has value or not.

And heading towards a food supply that is completely controlled and patented by a corporation.





"The real strategy is to introduce so much genetic pollution that meeting the consumer demand for GM-free food is seen as not possible. The idea, quite simply, is to pollute faster than countries can legislate - then change the laws to fit the contamination.... Backed by predatory intellectual property laws, agribusinesses are on their way to getting the global food supply so hopelessly cross pollinated, polluted and generally mixed up, that legislators may well be forced to throw up their hands. When we look back on this moment, munching our genetically modified health-style food, we may well remember it as the precise turning point when we lost our real food options."

-Naomi Klein (When choice becomes just a memory, 2001)



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A number of studies over the past decade have revealed that genetically engineered foods can pose serious risks to humans, domesticated animals, wildlife and the environment. Human health effects can include higher risks of toxicity, allergenicity, antibiotic resistance, immune-suppression and cancer. As for environmental impacts, the use of genetic engineering in agriculture will lead to uncontrolled biological pollution, threatening numerous microbial, plant and animal species with extinction, and the potential contamination of all non-genetically engineered life forms with novel and possibly hazardous genetic material.

http://www.centerforfoodsafety.org/campaign/genetically-engineered-food/crops/


Monsanto’s Harvest of Fear
http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2008/05/monsanto200805.print



Monsanto Found Guilty of Chemical Poisoning in France
http://truth-out.org/news/item/6794





Superbug vs. Monsanto: Nature rebels against biotech titan
http://rt.com/usa/news/superbug-monsanto-corn-resistance-628/

A growing number of rootworms are now able to devour genetically modified corn specifically designed by Monsanto to kill those same pests. A new study shows that while the biotech giant may triumph in Congress, it will never be able to outsmart nature.

Western corn rootworms have been able to harmlessly consume the genetically modified maize, a research paper published in the latest issue of the journal GM Crops & Food reveals. A 2010 sample of the rootworm population had an elevenfold survival rate on the genetically modified corn compared to a control population. That’s eight times more than the year before, when the resistant population was first identified.

Experts are also noting that this year’s resistant rootworm populations are maturing earlier than expected. In fact, the time the bug’s larvae hatched was the earliest in decades.

“The Western corn rootworm 'season' is underway at a pace earlier than I have experienced since I began studying this versatile insect as a graduate student in the late 1970s,” entomologist Mike Gray wrote in The Bulletin, a periodical issued by the University of Chicago’s Department of Crop Studies.

Studies in other states have also revealed that the rootworm population is becoming increasingly resistant to genetically modified corn. Last year, Iowa State University researcher Aaron Gassmann noted that a number of farmers reported discovering, much to their dismay, that a large number of rootworms survived after the consumption of their GM crops. Gassmann branded these pests “superbugs.”

Farmers and food companies have increasingly been dependent on GM crops, and many have abandoned crop rotation, a practice that has been used to stave off pest infestations for centuries. Some have even gone as far as to ignore federal regulation, which require the GM corn plantations be accompanied by a small “refuge” of non-GM maize.

The recent findings have potentially devastating ramifications for both farmers and consumers. Genetic maize plantation would easily come under attack from the swelling number of “superbugs,” resulting in dwindling harvest numbers for farmers. Ultimately, consumers will pay the price not only for corn, an essential product whose derivatives are used in a plethora of products ranging from yogurts to baby powder, but for other crops sold in the market. Rising corn prices would mean that more farmers would plant corn, despite the risks, and the yield for other crops would drop. That would drive prices for virtually all food items up, hitting hard on a population already smitten by ongoing economic difficulties.

Monsanto launched its anti-rootworm GM corm in 2003. The Cry3Bb1 protein, derived from the Bacillus thuringiensis (Bt.) bacterium, was inserted into the corn’s genetic code. The embedded protein was supposed to be fatal to all rootworms.

The recent findings came days after Monsanto, along with other biotech companies, got a major boost from a congressional panel, which okayed the manufacture of GM crops despite pending legal challenges. Many of the lawsuits that Monsanto faces include assessments that its crops are unsafe for human consumption and affect the health of unborn children.

Monsanto has also been an active plaintiff itself. Its primary targets include entities that seek to label GM foods, and small farmers, whom the biotech behemoth accuses of using genetically modified crops patented by Monsanto.


Sorry but that sounds like a nightmare to me.




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Miss*Bijou

Sexy Troublemaker
Nov 9, 2006
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Looks good to me. Non-GM foods cause plenty of adverse reactions in folks sensitive to some of the proteins they contain & thus should get no free ride. As an example, 100% organic, heritage seed peanuts will still kill a person who is highly allergic to peanuts, but there is no large special interest group pushing to ban the growth an sale of peanuts.Folks have sensitivities to everything from gluten to shellfish but we still allow products containing them into the market. Why, because people have to either eat or die. Making more food stuffs available on the market, even if some folks cannot safely consume them, increases the overall food supply, ensuring that there is more food to go around.

Doesn't look good at all to me... :(

Of course, Non-GM foods may cause adverse reactions too but to take your example, if I know I'm allergic to peanuts, I can identify it and then avoid it - because this will be included on any labels for products that may contain peanuts.

GMO's are not labeled, likely will never be, which makes it almost impossible -or extremely difficult- to even know what to avoid because one doesn't even know what he or she has ingested in the first place! Aside from allergies, the other health risks that are being brought up are serious concerns that should not be ignored. What possible use would being able to feed the world be if it also means compromising our health, our future and our environment?

If it was such a gift to humanity, why in the world would there be so much resistance to providing evidence of its safety? Why in the world would there be such resistance in allowing people to know what they're about to eat? Why would hundreds of thousands of farmers have committed suicide as a direct consequence of having taken the GMO route and ended up ruined and indebted? If it's about feeding the world, why would the seeds be deliberately modified to become sterile after the first planting? None of it adds up and you're simply repeating the marketing line.

We already know what the effects, if any, of various non GM-food have on us - we've been "testing" them for hundreds of years.






One could go the 100% organic route one we accept that 75 - 90% of the people on the planet must die quickly to allow us that luxury. The green revolution that has allowed the world's population to swell to this level was not an altruistic endeavor. Large corporations created new chemical fertilizers which they sold, new chemical herbicides and pesticides that they sold and new conventional hybrid plants that they marketed and sold the seed for.

Because the people of the world are addicted to growth (more industry requiring more workers requiring larger populations) we need the ability to keep extending the green revolution. Right now, that means GMOs because nobody other than large chemical corporations are spending many research dollars on the problem of food production.

GMOs allow lower production costs (else no right minded farmer would buy the seed). The cost of seed is just one small part of those costs. Every time you move a wheel on a piece of farm equipment (to plow summer fallow, disk a field or spray for weeds) there are fuel and maintenance costs, There are time costs as well. Hours spent on the field are hours not spent at the off farm job as a welder or school teacher. Seeding with a "Round-up Ready" GMO plant means that the farmer can use that relatively inexpensive broad spectrum post-emergent herbicide at the optimal moment as required versus gambling that you even need it & using a potentially costly pre-emergent herbicide or being able to spay for only certain types of weeds infesting your crop.


It doesn't sound to me like that's the case AT ALL:



http://www.scientificamerican.com/p...=can-genetically-modified-crops-feed-09-04-16


Humans have been genetically modifying crops for millenia the old-fashioned way—selective breeding. But new techniques that insert foreign genetic material, say bacterial genes to produce insecticide in a corn plant, have raised health and environmental concerns. And that has prompted European countries, most recently Germany, to ban genetically modified, or GM, crops.

Proponents argue that GM crops can help feed the world. And given ever increasing demands for food, animal feed, fiber and now even biofuels, the world needs all the help it can get.

Unfortunately, it looks like GM corn and soybeans won't help, after all.

A study from the Union of Concerned Scientists shows that genetically engineered crops do not produce larger harvests. Crop yield increases in recent years have almost entirely been due to improved farming or traditional plant breeding, despite more than 3,000 field trials of GM crops.

Of course, farmers have typically planted, say, GM corn, because it can tolerate high doses of weed-killer. And the Biotechnology Industry Organization argues that GM crops can boost yields in developing countries where there are limited resources for pesticides.

But it appears that, to date, traditional plant breeding boosts crop yields better than genetic modification. Those old farmers were on to something.




Hans Herren, Ph.D. is an internationally recognized scientist specializing in sustainable agriculture. He is president of the Millennium Institute, a non-profit development research and service organization dedicated to sustainable development. Dr. Herren co-chaired the International Assessment of Agricultural Knowledge, Science & Technology (IAASTD), an initiative sponsored by the World Bank and United Nations in partnership with the World Health Organization that assessed global agriculture and recommended agroecological solutions to world hunger.

Dr. Herren has earned numerous awards that recognize his research achievements. These include the 2002 Brandenberger Preis for improving the living standards of Africa's rural population, the 2003 Tyler Prize for Environmental Achievement, and the 1995 World Food Prize for his work developing a successful biological control program that saved the African cassava crop, and averted Africa’s worst-ever food crisis.

Dr. Herren’s work in agroecology in Africa has been credited with saving millions of lives by enabling African people to produce the food they need. He developed the “push-pull” system that uses simple but powerful bio-control strategies to effectively manage corn pests, resulting in large increases in yields.



There is much discussion today about the need to “feed the world” because of the growing global population. What do you think needs to be done in order to ensure there is adequate food for everyone in the world?

HH: The issue is less on how to feed the world than how to nourish the poor and hungry. Today we produce 4600 calories per person per day, so there is enough food to feed twice the present population. The problem is that we produce mostly cheap commodities rather than quality food. These cheap products, in addition to being of low nutritional value, are based on a few crops that carry a large ecological, social, and economic footprint. What is needed is to support farmers in developing countries to grow their own healthy food by providing information, know-how, financial support for inputs, and support for them to access markets, among others.

Food security is achieved when availability, access, stability, and utilization are assured equally for all. There is also a need for new and participatory research into sustainable agricultural practices, based on the principles of agroecology and organic farming, which would free farmers from dependence on external inputs such as chemical pesticides and fertilizers.


Some agricultural “experts” are calling for another Green Revolution. What are your thoughts on this?

HH: What we need least is another Green Revolution. What is needed now is to move forward with the lessons learned from the Green Revolution, taking forward what has worked and leave behind most of it, since the Green Revolution has left agriculture dependent on external inputs that are non-sustainable and becoming more and more expensive since they are based on oil, a finite resource, and also synthetic fertilizers, also based on finite natural resources.

The way forward is to understand and work with the system in a holistic and integrated manner. Silver bullets, reductionism as often promoted by the agri-chemical industry are not solutions.


The IAASTD report recommends, as you do, the need for a holistic approach to agricultural production. What do you mean by this?

HH: By this we mean to always consider agriculture multi-functionality, the fact that it is realized in the overlapping areas of the environment, society, and economy. Agriculture is not simply the production of food as seen under the Green Revolution: agriculture produces a number of essential eco-social system services, which we need to consider when making any decision about the food system, from production to consumption. This is also the reason that we have been promoting a payment to farmers for these ecosystem services, providing additional income to farmers that take the route of sustainable production.


The IAASTD report received very little press in the United States. Prince Charles said at a conference in Washington, DC last year that the findings from the report seem to have “vanished.” Any thoughts on this?

HH: The report was not well received by the US, Canada, and Australia, where major commodity exporters, major producers of agriculture inputs, such as seeds and fertilizers, and the largest food processors are based.

However, the report received a good response from UN agencies such as UNCTAD (United Nations Conference on Trade and Development), UNEP (United Nations Environment Program), and also the natural resources department at FAO (UN Food and Agriculture Organization), some governments and in particular civil society groups and foundations. For example, the African Union has adopted ecological/organic farming as one of the agricultural practices that need to be promoted across Africa to help achieve food security sustainably in the face of the climate change challenges.


Do you think that organic/agroecological methods can help feed the world?

HH: Agroecological, eco-efficient, and organic agriculture, which are among the several good agricultural practices under the label “sustainable agriculture,” cannot only nourish a world population of some 9 to 10 billion people, but are the only approaches that will be able to do it in the face of climate change, natural resource scarcity, and growing demand challenges. Unless we have the resilience provided by these systems at the basis of our multi-functional production systems, we will face major problems.

So the solutions are at hand, there is evidence from the field for now over three decades that sustainable agriculture cannot only nourish the world, but can do so for the long haul.


Are organic and agroecological methods one and the same?

HH: Not exactly, for the reason that organic is a simplified form of agroecological farming practices, which does include also social elements, that are not yet part of organic. Also agroecology is the science that underlies agroecological practices, including the social and economic sciences, in addition to the natural sciences.

There are no certification needs in agroecological practices, contrary to organic, which follow a strict set of rules that vary from country to country.



What is your opinion of genetically modified crops?


HH: This is a technology that addresses symptoms rather than cause, so it’s of little use in sustainable systems. Also, GM crops create dependencies that are not in the interest of the farmers or consumers in the medium and long term.

We have now already seen the problems that arise from resistance build-up of weeds as well as insects, which are no longer affected by the killer chemicals that accompany the herbicide tolerant crops and also the insect resistant ones.

GMOs are a reductionist approach used in a complex system; no wonder they already fail just as the pesticides failed. Furthermore, GMOs promote the wrong type of production system: few different crops in the rotation and monocrop practices that go against the wisdom of sustainable agriculture which uses a large number of different crops to increase diversity and so resilience.

In brief, GMOs do not provide any substantial medium or long term benefit, either for the farmer or the consumers.


There is a push now to grow GM crops in Africa. The Gates Foundation is funding research on GM crops in Africa and other nations. What are your thoughts on this?

HH: We do not need GMOs in Africa nor anywhere else. To promote GMOs in Africa is wrongheaded, will make farmers dependent on input suppliers in the medium and long term and contribute to the loss of important local landraces (plant species).

What we need are resilient cropping systems where we have fertile soils loaded with organic matter, humus, which will not only absorb lots of carbon, but will also store water and nutrients to be released at the pace plants can pick up. Such soil also increases many of the nutrients needed by the plants, making the use of fertilizers unnecessary, except in isolated situations, such as when phosphate may be totally lacking.

We have shown in experiments and on some 50,000 farms that farm productivity can be raised easily by a factor of two to four, when applying agroecological methods.


Proponents of GMOs like to claim they will help feed the world. What do you think?

HH: We already produce more food than needed; despite this we have 950 million people hungry. In India food is rotting in warehouses, yet India has the highest childhood malnutrition rate in the world.

The proof that this system does not work is confirmed by the fact that after 20 years of GMOs the global situation has not improved. Why continue and emphasize further a system that is failing to change food security?

Not to say that the traditional agriculture in developing countries is all okay. To the contrary, there is a need to change the paradigm and move on with new participatory research, extension and farmer training into new sustainable agricultural methods.


You’ve said that agricultural research should be in the public sector. Why do you think this is important?

HH: The public sector, government, needs to take the responsibility to assure food security for all again. The devolution of this responsibility to the private sector was wrongheaded and needs to be rectified as soon as possible.

Food is a human right, and there should be no patents on seeds (as we have now by private companies). Seeds belong to the global public good or public domain.

There are opportunities for the private sector to be involved in the many aspects of food storage, processing, and marketing, very much at the local level with farmer participation in these businesses.

http://www.non-gmoreport.com/articles/december2011/scientistsaysagroecologyfeedsworld.php




Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack was getting lots of appreciative applause and head nods from the packed hall at the Community Food Security Coalition conference today, held in Des Moines, Iowa. He described the USDA's plans to improve school nutrition, support local food systems, and work with the Justice Department to review the impact of corporate agribusiness on small farmers. But then, with time for only one more question, I was handed the microphone.

"Mr. Secretary, may I ask a tough question on GMOs?"

He said yes.

"The American Academy of Environmental Medicine this year said that genetically modified foods, according to animal studies, are causally linked to accelerated aging, dysfunctional immune regulation, organ damage, gastrointestinal distress, and immune system damage. A study came out by the Union of Concerned Scientists confirming what we all know, that genetically modified crops, on average, reduce yield. A USDA report from 2006 showed that farmers don't actually increase income from GMOs, but many actually lose income. And for the last several years, the United States has been forced to spend $3-$5 billion per year to prop up the prices of the GM crops no one wants.


"When you were appointed Secretary of Agriculture, many of our mutual friends—I live in Iowa and was proud to have you as our governor—assured me that you have an open mind and are very reasonable and forward thinking. And so I was very excited that you had taken this position as Secretary of Agriculture. And I'm wondering, have you ever heard this information? Where do you get your information about GMOs? And are you willing to take a delegation in D.C. to give you this hard evidence about how GMOs have actually failed us, that they've been put onto the market long before the science is ready, and it's time to put it back into the laboratory until they've done their homework."

The room erupted into the loudest applause of the morning.

Secretary Vilsack knew at once what kind of crowd he was dealing with. Or so I thought.

He said he was willing to visit with folks, to read studies, to learn as much as he possibly can. He pointed out that there are lots of studies, not necessarily consistent, even conflicting. He said he was in the process of working on a set of regulations and had brought proponents and opponents together to search for common ground. And he was looking to create a regulatory system with sufficient assurances and protections.

At this point in his answer, Secretary Vilsack, who has a history of favoring GMOs—and even appears to be more pro-GMO than his Bush administration predecessors—was trying to sound even handed. Then he made a tragic mistake.

After a slight pause, he added in a warm tone, "I will tell you that the world is very concerned about the ever-increasing population of the globe and the capacity to be able to feed all of those people."

Moans, groans, hisses, even boos. Not rowdy, mind you. But clearly agitated.

You see, the people in the room were among the top experts at actually feeding the world. They included numerous PhDs who had spent their careers looking deeply into the issue. Among those present were several of the authors of the authoritative IAASTD report. The International Assessment of Agricultural Knowledge, Science and Technology for Development, is the most comprehensive evaluation of world agriculture ever. It was a three-year collaborative effort with 900 participants and 110 countries, and was co-sponsored by all the majors, e.g. the World Bank, FAO, UNESCO, WHO. The behemoth effort evaluated the last 50 years of agriculture, and prescribed the methods that were now needed to meet the development and sustainability goals of reducing hunger and poverty, improving nutrition, health and rural livelihoods, and facilitating social and environmental sustainability.

And GMOs was not one of those needed methods! It was clear to the experts that the current generation of GMOs did not live up to the hype continuously broadcast by biotech companies and their promotional East Coast wing—the federal government.

In fact, the night before Vilsack addressed the conference, the same audience heard a keynote by Hans Herren, the co-chairman of the IAASTD report, during which he reiterated that biotechnology was not up to the task. And this morning, Hans Herren was in the room when Vilsack tried to play the feed-the-world card. Bad move.

Vilsack responded to the crowd's rejection by saying, "And well you all can disagree with this, but I am just telling you this. As I travel the world, I am just telling you what people are telling me. They are very concerned about this."

Thus, he distanced himself from the contentious, and fallacious, argument. He was just reporting what others had told him.

And that may in fact be his problem with understanding the serious health and environmental dangers of GMOs in general, if he is simply, as he says, repeating what others—Monsanto, Syngenta, DuPont—have told him over and over again.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jeffrey-smith/vilsack-mistakenly-pitche_b_319998.html
 

Tugela

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GMO's are not labeled, likely will never be, which makes it almost impossible -or extremely difficult- to even know what to avoid because one doesn't even know what he or she has ingested in the first place! Aside from allergies, the other health risks that are being brought up are serious concerns that should not be ignored. What possible use would being able to feed the world be if it also means compromising our health, our future and our environment?

If it was such a gift to humanity, why in the world would there be so much resistance to providing evidence of its safety? Why in the world would there be such resistance in allowing people to know what they're about to eat? Why would hundreds of thousands of farmers have committed suicide as a direct consequence of having taken the GMO route and ended up ruined and indebted? If it's about feeding the world, why would the seeds be deliberately modified to become sterile after the first planting? None of it adds up and you're simply repeating the marketing line.

We already know what the effects, if any, of various non GM-food have on us - we've been "testing" them for hundreds of years.
There is no evidence that health and safety are being compromised - that is a scare tactic used by activists, they have no data to support their position either, beyond appealing to emotion. It is not feasible to get data one way or the other either, because any such studies can only be done with largescale use of the products. Activists are well aware of this, which is why they want to prevent largescale use. That way they don't have to prove their position and they dont risk being proved wrong. They just have to say it is bad because it is not natural.

The resistance to GMOs is primarily due to fear mongering, not because of any demonstrated risk.

Hundreds of thousands of farmers committing suicide? Really?? Is the body count in the prairies that high allready?

Seeds becoming infertile after the first planting are intended to prevent the risk of cross breeding, one of the other things that activists try to scare people with. You can't have it both ways. And in any case there is the risk of devolution if you allow multiple generations, eventually resulting in the loss of desirable characteristics. This will happen in conventional seed as well.

You haven't been testing non GM foods for hundreds of years, most cultivars and hybrids used nowdays are fairly recent in origin. The strains used for hundreds of years are far less productive.

Btw, allmost all food species are not found in the wild. They have evolved from some ancestor with the help of man through selective breeding, and are dependent on a symbiotic relationship with humans.
 

Tugela

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Only, there are many significant differences. Just to name a few:

Plants haven't yet naturally produced (and never will) an insecticide to attack the very insects that pollinate them[/URL] - bioengineered plants, on the other hand, may have done just that. They may have been effectively responsible for killing off entire colonies and been responsible for a serious crisis that has been unexplained for a few years and which seriously threatens global food production.[/COLOR][/FONT]

Plants that have not been bioengineered are also not patented by a huge corporation, which then makes insane profits selling their patented seeds.

Plants that have not been bioengineered can be re-used from year to year by farmers, unlike bioengineered patented seeds that have also been modified to be useless after the first year's planting.

Plants that have not been bioengineered do not contaminate other plants, whether bioengineered or not, with their genes - in effect, spreading a patented product whether farmers want it or not, and then exposing them to law suits for their unauthorized use of patented seeds.

Genetically modified foods have not and are not thoroughly scientifically tested.

They are not identified on labels - why is that? If there is absolutely nothing different with the end product, why would there be so much resistance to letting consumers know what they're eating?




What makes you think you know what I do or don't understand? :rolleyes:

A naturally produced insecticide in a crop is going to have less impact on the environment than mass spraying artificial insecticides. If something doesn't have a natural insecticide, it will be sprayed with an artificial insecticide, your bees will die just the same. In any case no one is going to produce a plant to delibrately kill its own pollinator. That is rediculous. In fact, the insecticide that is killing the bees is not even produced by the plant itself, it is applied to the plant. It is called clothianidin and it is used to treat seeds before planting, presumably to prevent predation.

There is nothing stopping farmers from using regular seed. So, Monsanto making profit selling a more productive product is no sin.

A conventionally produced hybrid or cultivar is just as able to contaminate local plants.

The seed is made sterile precisely to prevent the very thing you are concerned about, but even that is a plot?

A law suit wont work if there a few plants contaminating a field. But, if the entire field is the same as the engineered plant, then obviously stuff has been misappropriated.
 
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