how much do you think a good SP earn/yr?

[lenny]

Good post. I am glad that one of the ladies wrote this. As a customer of sp's it may seem like the ladies are making easy money, and lots of it. However, think about what it takes to be a really quality sp and you will see that there are many hidden costs involved.

A lady who works constantly (ie 5 days/week, 45 weeks/year) would soon find herself burned out I would imagine.

If you think that the ladies have an easy job, and that sp'ing is easy money, I suggest that you really try to imagine what is involved in the job...

Perhaps the burnout factor would depend on the SP and how
much she enjoys her work as many claim to do.

Four hours a day gets a good SP around 200 G tax free per year.
That's a cool million in just 5 years, 2 million in 10. That's also PT
& half the hours that most people work digging ditches, flipping
burgers, & etc...

But the original question asked about what a good FT SP makes.
That would be double the figures above, although i doubt even
10% work that much @ $200/hr. Still a lady making $300/hr at
20 hours/wk is grossing 300G/yr. with almost 2 months holiday.
And at $400/hr its 400G/yr.

 

[westwoody]

Perhaps the burnout factor would depend on the SP

Some girls don't look at it as a lifelong pursuit:they plan to do it for a set period and then move on. The girl I mentioned above used to call it "power-hoing", she worked very hard but she knew her clock was ticking and she would be out of it soon.

 

[maverick73]

My research has shown...

Ok, without naming names, I've actually ASKED and verified with certain SP's...

1. One made about $6,000 per month, seeing 1-2 clients per day (usually 1, but 2 max), but not working every day. Unfortunately, $5,000 of it went to crack.

2. Another made about $10,000 per month with a record of $20,000-$30,000 per month in her peak months, but quickly burnt out and is now at a more leisure pace. Once again, almost all of it went to crack or plastic surgery.

It's not what you make, it's what you keep. Unfortunately, the sad truth is I am willing to bet about 50% or more (even the "SP's" that have their own "incall" places) are feeding some sort of habit. SP's like Jodie, Eden, and Julia are more the exception than the rule.

Is it possible the average of $3,200 that Jodie quoted took into account SW's that brought down the average?

Based on my rough research, I would say the average income is about $5,000 per month for any SP that wants to keep her sanity. $5,000 to $10,000 is possible after an SP is established with higher end clients and higher end service for those clients, most of which should be of the repeat variety by then. Anything over $10,000, that SP is either really good or committed, or is on the way up to an eventual market "correction"...

I do not think it is healthy for an SP to see more than 1-2 clients per day, 5 days per week. MAYBE 3 occasionally. Seeing more than 3 or working continually is usually signs that the cash is being used to feed a habit.

 

[maverick73]

Some girls don't look at it as a lifelong pursuit:they plan to do it for a set period and then move on. The girl I mentioned above used to call it "power-hoing", she worked very hard but she knew her clock was ticking and she would be out of it soon.

POWER-HOING.... LOL.... great word. I'll call that a westwoodism....

 

[noneasgood]

Of course, she can't do that many things that has future value with that unless she has good credit. But good credit requires someone with a legit income. That's where I came in, because it is doubtful an SP can keep a regular job and still provide services to that degree.

The one thing that she could do on her own that has future value with that money is go to post-secondary for 2 years without working, but she would have to live like most students.

QUOTE]
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That is a valid point . I have heard a few young sps saying that they are saving up money to buy an apartment.Since being a sp is not exactly a legit income and will be quite difficult for them to qualify for a mortgage.

Doesn't matter if it's legit income or not, you can still report it on your taxes. In fact, it's a seperate crime if you don't. If you do report most of it, you'd then create a credit history, which is a very powerful thing to have.

My guesstimate regarding annual income for a decent $300/hr sp who doesn't overdue it and is selective about who she sees and has a social life etc. would be about 100-125K. That means she works about 4 days a week at 2hrs a day = 2400/wk ~ 6,000/mo * 12 = 96,000 add another hour a day, subtract for holidays and you'd probably get to the higher end of the range.

 

[noneasgood]

I'd be curious what they put on the income tax documents for their type
of employment. Self-employed?

And do they write off a lot of business expenses like travel, rent, lube,
condoms?

Yup. If they are being honest this is what they would do a credit rating is a very powerful thing to have in society and the smart ones who own their own appartments etc. do so by establishing credit.

There was an interesting article in the Vancouver Sun today about this very topic, which says in part:

"If you are involved in allegedlly illegal activities, the Canada Revenue Agency can't make you file delinquent tax returns under the Income Tax Act if it will expose you to a criminal investigation, the Federal Court of Canada has ruled."

The key issue here is whether or not the government is seeking civil penalties or undertaking a criminal investigation. If the later, then a taxpayer doesn't have to provide the government with anything. Judge Cambell said in part "a taxpayer can't be forced to provide information that would incriminate himself in criminal activities."

The taxpayer was smart enough to get Thorsteinssons involved, who rank as the best tax lawyers I know of.

The article then goes on to say this ruling is consistant with the Supreme Court ruling that says "the tax department can't use information gathered in it's civil proceedings for a criminal investigation."

So basically this means a couple of things.

One is that CRA can still go after you for tax evasion etc. but they can't force you to provide them with any information to assist them in your own prosecution.

I'm not a lawyer, so I might stand corrected on this, but I also believe that it might mean CRA can't obtain information primarily obtained for civil purposes and then later use that information for criminal proceedings. Meaning if they went after you for not filing a tax return and then found you were doing something illegal, I don't think they can't use the information acquired during their civil investigation against you on the criminal charges. Any lawyers what to comment on this?

Secondly, unless parliament changes it, this is the law of the land, it's been to the highest court. (Although this particular case could still be appealed if the fact pattern is sufficiently different enough from the Supreme Court case being cited)

As a practical matter it means that CRA is likely to stick to handing out civil penalties, such as charging interest and penalties rather than seeking criminal charges, which is pretty much what it does most of the time anyway.

 

[maverick73]

Doesn't matter if it's legit income or not, you can still report it on your taxes. In fact, it's a seperate crime if you don't. If you do report most of it, you'd then create a credit history, which is a very powerful thing to have.

My guesstimate regarding annual income for a decent $300/hr sp who doesn't overdue it and is selective about who she sees and has a social life etc. would be about 100-125K. That means she works about 4 days a week at 2hrs a day = 2400/wk ~ 6,000/mo * 12 = 96,000 add another hour a day, subtract for holidays and you'd probably get to the higher end of the range.

That is about right for an established SP that has been at it for a couple years with a good regular client base and a higher rate of $300-$400 and up. However, it seems few make it past the first year. $60,000 is a more realistic number. Unfortunately, probably less than 20% are smart with their money. It either goes to a "habit", expensive designer clothes, plastic surgery, extravagant vacations, designer hand bags, or to their "man" who always finds a bad way to spend it.

 

[Cock Throppled]

There was an interesting article in the Vancouver Sun today about this very topic, which says in part:

"If you are involved in allegedlly illegal activities, the Canada Revenue Agency can't make you file delinquent tax returns under the Income Tax Act if it will expose you to a criminal investigation, the Federal Court of Canada has ruled."


... unless parliament changes it, this is the law of the land, it's been to the highest court. (Although this particular case could still be appealed if the fact pattern is sufficiently different enough from the Supreme Court case being cited)

In fact, prostitution in not illegal in Canada.

 

[ace85]

Mortgage COmpanies

There are tons of Mortgage companies out their designed to provide credit to non traditional empoyment.

MAV and LENNY, listen to Jodie. She isn't trying to bull shit anyone. Take your numbers and cut them in half. On a short term there are some girls that could make mad cash, but if you take a 2 year average it is probably 1/2 of what you want it to be.

My suggestiion is the Quality girls work to build a stable of regulars, so they can count on $x per month to pay their bills, and then they might look for some extras when they are looking to purchase something.

I would also suggest they are looking for 1 or 2 really high end clients that book extended sessions or tip or treat at a higher level.

1 of those each month would cover 2 or 3 new / short 1 hour sessions, and I am thinking that the longer term sugar daddy / high roller type would be much more enjoyable and less like work.

Make a living, avoid big debts and get to have sex with guys like me. What a lifestyle. Maverick I am surprised you haven't started being an SP already.

 

[BobbiVan]

Income

Like Annalise said, it's easy to set up a home based business to pay taxes from. I want credit like anyone else, so that's what I did. I pay Taxes.

I see maybe 4 clients a week, by choice, to keep me from burning out. Some of those are multi-hour, but not all, so minimum $300 x 4 = 1200

$1200/wk, working 45 wks of the year, a VERY average $54,000/year.

I dont' have a habit, or buy expensive clothes, or plastic surgery..... I pay my rent, buy some food, pay the bills, pay to advertise, spoil my daughter a bit.. and badda bing badda BOOM. Broke.



I'm not in this business to be a millionaire, or even rich.... I'm here because I love it, and it keeps me from having to get a 'real' job. haha

 

[Herb_The_Perb]

If a SP is paying taxes on their entirely legal job, they get to take off all costs. That would be the driver, incall, toys and safety supplies.

Check out the Stats Canada figures on Professional Companions.

Can you give us a link, or summarize their info?

 

[maverick73]

Maverick and a few others have stated few of us ladies are smart with their money.......... I beg to differ ! There are lots of ladies who are wise with their income and choice to live like they where poppers and invest or put away a large portion of their money. Personally I think it is more age then anything.

As much as I want 100% of the ladies in the business to be smart with their money, I just don't think it's a very high percentage. I'll add you to the 20% group though . It's usually the late 20's and older group that is smarter with their money (Jodie being the exception ). The early 20's group spends everything they earn. Then again, it's not necessarily within the profession only. Most early 20's women (and probably men too) spend everything they earn regardless of profession.

 

[maverick73]

1. MAV and LENNY, listen to Jodie. She isn't trying to bull shit anyone. Take your numbers and cut them in half. On a short term there are some girls that could make mad cash, but if you take a 2 year average it is probably 1/2 of what you want it to be.

2. Make a living, avoid big debts and get to have sex with guys like me. What a lifestyle. Maverick I am surprised you haven't started being an SP already.

1. Lenny said something about 200k a year. I said 60k a year. Why are you grouping me with Lenny? 60k a year is probably almost bang on for a full time SP. Jodie's post of about 40k a year is probably more of a slightly above part time SP's income.

2. I'll make sure you get put on the TCL (Top Clients List), the list where all the clients are well off, well hung, and well, just full of themselves.

 

[maverick73]

hmmmmmmmmmmm to bad Jodie is the only one.... you might consider investing more investigation on this .... because she isn't !!

Of course Jodie isn't the only one... I was just saying that in her age group, she is MORE the exception than the rule... not the only exception. If you took a sample of SP's between 20-25, I highly doubt you will find more than 1-2 "Jodies" for every 10 sampled. I'm confident the numbers increase with age. In fact, after a certain age, I think it may even be possible that 8 out of every 10 are good with their money out of necessity. I haven't done an official survey, just an unofficial one based on my probably biased personal experience.

 

[sweet&sassyxoxo]

As much as I want 100% of the ladies in the business to be smart with their money, I just don't think it's a very high percentage. I'll add you to the 20% group though . It's usually the late 20's and older group that is smarter with their money (Jodie being the exception ). The early 20's group spends everything they earn. Then again, it's not necessarily within the profession only. Most early 20's women (and probably men too) spend everything they earn regardless of profession.

I have been an sp for 5 years i wont give you exact $$$ but guys after you pay mortgage ,car payment ,insurance ,regular bills ,babysitter ,food ,gas and yes TAXES ,ESP, yadda yadda you end up with a whole lot of nothing! i also go to school (no student loans) man would i love beable to save!! sp's arnt makin millions and if you dont want the goverment knockin at your door the smart ones do pay taxes. we by all means arnt suffering but we dont all live the high life!

 

[Sunset]

Like Annalise said, it's easy to set up a home based business to pay taxes from. I want credit like anyone else, so that's what I did. I pay Taxes.

I see maybe 4 clients a week, by choice, to keep me from burning out. Some of those are multi-hour, but not all, so minimum $300 x 4 = 1200

$1200/wk, working 45 wks of the year, a VERY average $54,000/year.

I dont' have a habit, or buy expensive clothes, or plastic surgery..... I pay my rent, buy some food, pay the bills, pay to advertise, spoil my daughter a bit.. and badda bing badda BOOM. Broke.

I'm not in this business to be a millionaire, or even rich.... I'm here because I love it, and it keeps me from having to get a 'real' job. haha

I have to agree 100% with Bobbi; I think she has captured the essence of this whole discussion. It’s not about becoming a millionaire, it about doing something you enjoy without the hassles of a real job. Most of all, Bobbi’s methodology of limiting clients and projecting an achievable goal is a financial model that other SP’s should consider. Don’t you just love a beautiful, intelligent, non-paranoid and highly sexual woman?

History tells us the best way to develop wealth is still the ole fashion way by developing something that humans want to satisfy or excite their imagination and to reduce pain/suffering. Then grow the business based on that demand using modern management techniques. Or, invest in businesses that have a high potential for growth and/or is growing. But, this model is not available to a SP because her product is herself and can’t be reproduced to increase growth. Therefore, Bobbi’s financial model seems viable and realistic.

Definition of Earnings from an investment point is:

“Revenues minus cost of sales, operating expenses, and taxes, over a given period of time. Earnings are the reason corporations exist, and are often the single most important determinant of a stock's price. Earnings are important to investors because they give an indication of the company's expected future dividends and its potential for growth and capital appreciation. That does not necessarily mean that low or negative earnings always indicate a bad stock; for example, many young companies report negative earnings as they attempt to grow quickly enough to capture a new market, at which point they'll be even more profitable than they otherwise might have been. also called income.”

 

[RobBC]

Like Annalise said, it's easy to set up a home based business to pay taxes from. I want credit like anyone else, so that's what I did. I pay Taxes.

I see maybe 4 clients a week, by choice, to keep me from burning out. Some of those are multi-hour, but not all, so minimum $300 x 4 = 1200

$1200/wk, working 45 wks of the year, a VERY average $54,000/year.

Okay A) you yourself pointed out that that's a minimum, and B) that's 54K while working only 16 hours a month. That is a looooong way from average. In fact, while I don't have the stats-can numbers in front of me, I would be extremely surprised if the annual salary for someone in Canada is 54K a year (IIRC about ten years ago it was between 30-40K a year, so that'd be some pretty extreme inflation if it was 54K).

I'm not trying to criticize or flame, but 54K annually for a very part time job is something that very few people get to have, so I think average is not the best word to describe it.

I dont' have a habit, or buy expensive clothes, or plastic surgery..... I pay my rent, buy some food, pay the bills, pay to advertise, spoil my daughter a bit.. and badda bing badda BOOM. Broke.

Of course all this is relative. I'm sure there are many perb-erts on here who make 6-figures and feel the same way (buy a couple of luxury items here, nothing too extravagant and boom - broke). OTOH, I'm sure there are also many perb-erts on here who make under 30K a year and would say the same thing. You live up to the standard you earn. I have a friend who at one time was living on less than $15K a year as a student, then went to Europe and at one point was making $200K+ a year. To this day he still doesn't feel as though he was really living any differently during either time, it was just that the things he'd buy or go out and do became more expensive.

 

[wilde]

There are tons of Mortgage companies out their designed to provide credit to non traditional empoyment.

And breaking all the rules in the process.

 

[wilde]

Not nessecarily... if you can prove your annual income has increased while being self employed by the institutions regulations then how are they breaking the rules

If you could do that then you wouldn't need "those" mortgage companies.

 

[Ariel]

Ok this is all hypothetical but just say an sp works 5 days a week and see's 2 clients a day(i'm being minimalistic because some days she may see three) Only days off are the 2 days she recharges per week.If she's in Victoria charging $200 an hr how much is she going to make? If she's in Vancouver charging $300 an hr how much is she going to make per year. This is assuming no children, being frugal,rent, bills, food etc (between 900 and 1200 per month.Lets just say $1000.)Add in spending abit on investments and what do you get? Say that this is mostly tax free earnings. You get about 80,000 in Victoria and in Van about 120,000(I rounded down )So if you don't include investment earnings etc..... 100,000 is probably a pretty accurate figure for some sps.